Why are engineers better than doctors

Starting medicine vs. finished engineering degree

Hippo_  📅 11.07.2018 15:35:47
Starting medicine vs. finished engineering degree
Hello everybody,

now comes a long post, arm yourself with patience!

As the title suggests, I am now at a crossroads between starting a medical degree or completing my engineering degree and then working as an engineer.

Briefly something about me: I grew up in another EU country (not a native German speaker!) And came to Germany when I was 19 to study electrical engineering. First of all, for a long time I wasn't sure what the right course of study would be for me, as I was actually an all-round player at school. I found math and physics more or less interesting than the other subjects, with my strongest foreign language learning. I thought to myself that electrical engineering would actually be a good decision there
  • Would match my interest in math and physics (but I was good in all subjects at school, 1.0 Abi
  • (Apparent) lack of engineers propagated by the media / VDI / lobbies -> engineers are wanted -> good career opportunities and good earnings.
Everything else was actually naive and idealistic, sometimes also unrealistic ideas
  • with an engineer you can do everything later,
  • you do not have to commit yourself to a certain day-to-day life (e.g. as a doctor in a hospital) and location (you can travel for work -> other countries, other cultures). The latter actually fit into the picture, because I speak German and English really well, plus my mother tongue, plus possibly another language during my studies
  • I wanted to become a founder, bring a product to market, become successful, founder, entrepreneur, etc.
  • My parents more or less gave me hope, but I made the decision myself.
About the course: I'm studying electrical engineering at a TU9 university, whose name I don't want to reveal. All I am saying is that she is a leader in the field.

Shortly:

  • Now: 2nd master's semester in electrical engineering
  • Bachelor completed in the standard period of study, top 15-20%
Now comes the problem. I was completely frustrated during my bachelor's degree:
  • Teaching at the university: awful
  • Exams: abnormal, sometimes you don't understand it at all, but ask about some kind of rubbish. With solid preparation, I just passed some exams in exactly the same way.
  • Learning speed: incredibly fast, you don't have time to go into depth, because the 30 or so CP have to be achieved in the semester. As a result, bulimia learning, no interest in studying, no motivation
  • Original idea of ​​E-technology not confirmed. I felt that this wasn't right for me. Studying got on my nerves. I basically had to study all day to pass exams, and not for the sake of knowledge. Sure, you could think that you would learn something there anyway. But since you don't have time to think, your learning is limited and it's not fun to learn. I wanted to finish in the standard study time, not so clever in retrospect.
At some point the idea came up (in the third semester for the first time) to study medicine.
  • Job viewed, you save lives, you earn well, somehow give more meaning to life.
  • I was disappointed with the electrical engineering.
Now I have touched the subject in my family on the sidelines and my parents, who actually provided the ideas for the electrical engineering, said:
  • Medicine super exhausting
  • E-technology is becoming more interesting, so far only the basics (also true)
  • Engineer is not a bad job.
I could understand everything. I didn't really care about the first point, because the electrical engineering degree is no picnic either, but the decisive point for me was: I would actually have lost 2 years as a result (I didn't want to apply for medicine until the second year). I didn't want to put these 2 years in the sand, the interesting things in my studies were still to come.

So I decided for myself to finish my studies first and then “let's see”. After all, I'd already have a bachelor's degree in my pocket, so it wouldn't be wasted time.

The fifth and sixth semesters were also kind of a disaster. The course was just as boring and nerve-wracking as it was before. Nonsensical exams where you count yourself dead and take nothing with you.

In the sixth semester, I was actually desperate. The direction I was taking was not good for me. But somehow I didn't dare apply for medicine. After all, I would have lost 3 years in total, so I would study medicine up to the age of 29 and then train as a specialist.

Again the same conversation with the family: My argument was that I have a bachelor's degree and that it is a halfway full course. My parents said that if I did medicine for a few years, the bachelor's degree would be for the bin because I would forget most of it. So the 3 years would have been really in vain.

I could understand everything. And one usually hopes for much more from the master’s degree.

Current situation: 2nd master's semester, studies are actually going great, exams are based on understanding, I get along with the learning quite well, try to get to the bottom of things from the bachelor's degree and to understand the interrelationships in depth.

Actually, I should be satisfied. I've started to think about the future (yes, only now, after all, I wasn't sure whether I wanted to do that or not the whole time). And from hearsay from friends and from forums, I got the following insight.

  • It's really hard to find a good job as an engineer. It is very difficult to get into top corporations like Siemens and Bosch (I know from the Freundeskreis), the highly praised degree is not a door opener at all, at most a plus. In the end, you often have to cut back on your salary and sell yourself cheaply. Very few people should get the promised IG Metall tariff, most of them would work in quasi-precarious conditions in engineering service providers for less money.
  • If you still get a place, it is very difficult to get to the top of the career ladder in a corporation in order to earn decent earnings. And mostly vitamin B or luck are a prerequisite for this, or you have to be really mega good. Because I didn't even do my internship semester (only comes in the last semester), I don't think I would be able to do it. Besides, I'm not a German, but a foreigner. And that should also be important, according to a professional Dr.-Ing I know. Will be difficult to climb up with.
  • Conclusion: Gaining a foothold and reasonable remuneration: very difficult
Now you can think to yourself: Wow, the guy is really a nag, engineers earn a lot, compare the salary with that of a social worker z. B., etc pp.

Yes, of course, as an engineer you earn well. But how good? Open-ended positions are not easy to get, the lack of engineers is a phantom and for me you are often simply exploited. If you include the nerve-wracking studies: well, I don't see a linear correlation between investment and return. You don't just want to make ends meet, you want to live in safety. (High standards, yes).

In comparison, studying electrical engineering is no less complex than studying medicine. And now I regret that I didn't start studying medicine earlier. Because if I were to theoretically start next year (the deadline for this year has already passed), then five years would be in the sand! Then I would have to start at the age of 24, at 30 I would be an assistant doctor and if I then tie in as a specialist, you are 35-36 years old! On the one hand, I don't feel like building up my life like that. After all, I wouldn't have time for a family until I'm 30. To do this, I would have to get maintenance from my parents, etc.

On the other hand, I think I'd rather work as a doctor. Well, you should have made the decision at the beginning, but I had no experience at the time and first had to find out that the engineering degree is not for me or that I would rather do something different, at least in terms of money. And then there is the higher satisfaction from work.

I don't know how do you see that? From my point of view, I am a complainer who should rely on my four letters, and also a maximalist. On the other hand, this logical argument does not help at all, because for me it is emotionally charged. When I see someone who is studying medicine, I always think "that could have been me". For me it's just the better, because I get a kind of inferiority complex.
aldante  📅 11.07.2018 16:23:42
Re: starting medicine vs. finished engineering degree
You are in the 2nd master’s semester, i.e. for medicine you are already counting as a second degree applicant. Complete the master’s degree (never hurts) and then study medicine. The one year doesn't matter anymore. (Plus, you can't apply until next year anyway - one more reason to complete your master’s degree.)

However, to a certain extent your whining actually misses the topic, because firstly, studying is not your job (and just because you don't like your studies doesn't mean that you won't like the job either) and secondly you don't even know whether you would actually "only" find an "average" engineering job.

It can also happen to you while studying medicine that you are reluctant to study, even though you like your job, and it can also happen to you when studying medicine that you end up just becoming an internist in the understaffed district dump with lots of doctors who can barely speak German , instead of internist at the super-elite university clinic with Prof. Dr. Dr. Mega ego. However, you will almost certainly earn more than as an electrical engineer.

Just do what interests you more professionally. However, it will be difficult to get a place in the second degree quota. Be prepared to have to study in Austria.
mulder  📅 11.07.2018 18:00:52
Re: starting medicine vs. finished engineering degree
Is it such a big problem for you if you haven't finished starting your family in your 20s?

"3 years lost"
"3 years really been in vain"
"After all, I would have lost a total of 3 years"
"then five years would be in the sand!"
"And now I regret that I didn't start studying medicine sooner."

That is "German Angst" in its purest form. Things don't always go perfectly straight away. To regret something does not bring you anything.
Hippo_  📅 11.07.2018 18:42:01
Re: starting medicine vs. finished engineering degree
From mulder Is it such a big problem for you if you haven't finished starting your family in your 20s?

"3 years lost"
"3 years really been in vain"
"After all, I would have lost a total of 3 years"
"then five years would be in the sand!"
"And now I regret that I didn't start studying medicine sooner."

That is "German Angst" in its purest form. Things don't always go perfectly straight away. To regret something does not bring you anything.
Whether it's a big problem: well, of course there are certainly worse ones. Especially since there is no optimal decision in this situation and you would have to accept something.

It just bothers me that I would have wasted 5 years out of my life because the two courses are not related at all apart from a physics lecture in the first semester.
Re: starting medicine vs. finished engineering degree
By hippopotamus
  • It's really hard to find a good job as an engineer. It is very difficult to get into top corporations like Siemens and Bosch (I know from the Freundeskreis), the highly praised degree is not a door opener at all, at most a plus point. In the end, you often have to cut your wages and sell yourself cheaply. Very few people should get the promised IG Metall tariff, most of them would work in quasi-precarious conditions in engineering service providers for less money.
  • If you still get a place, it is very difficult to get to the top of the career ladder in a company in order to earn decent earnings. And mostly vitamin B or luck are a prerequisite for this, or you have to be really mega good. Because I didn't even do my internship semester (only comes in the last semester), I don't think I would be able to do it. Besides, I'm not a German, but a foreigner. And that should also be important, according to a professional Dr.-Ing I know. Will be difficult to climb up with.
  • Conclusion: Gaining a foothold and reasonable remuneration: very difficult
I think your assessment is completely exaggerated and not at all in line with reality. It reads like you've heard some bad rumors and are inferring the general public from them. In any case, I cannot confirm that, I know a lot of electrical engineers myself who found a very good job after completing their studies, although only a few directly in the group, but I also know some who are very unhappy in the group (hardly any responsibility or room for their own ideas, you are only "one of many" and can hardly make a difference, etc.) and some who are very satisfied with the medium-sized company.

My question to you would be: Have you already seen an industrial company from the inside? Have you done internships or working student activities? Then you would on the one hand see that the professional world as an engineer is completely different from studying and on the other hand you would massively increase your chances of getting a good job after graduating. Especially if you are one of the best in your class in terms of grades, you don't need to worry about a good job, provided you have some practical experience.